Not Just Tactics
Not Just Tactics is a Warmachine podcast featuring fresh perspectives on the game and its community. This will be done through product review, game play mechanics, tactics, lore, and various other content.
Not Just Tactics
From Black Thirteenth To Covert Legends: The Story And Strategy Of Allister Caine’s Gun Mage Cadre
A rogue with a badge isn’t supposed to be this effective. We open the case file on Allister Caine and the Hellslinger Starter Cadre. How a rule-breaking gun mage, a rebuilt Black Thirteenth, and a purpose-built warjack named Deuce became Cygnar’s sharpest scalpel on the modern battlefield. From the stolen skyship that saved his daughter to a promotion earned by the spymaster who once hunted him, Caine’s story is messy, human, and surprisingly tactical.
We connect the dots from early gun mage education to the Arcane Tempest’s formal training, mage lock firearms, and the doctrine that made precision fire a strategic pillar. Dixon Lynch’s innovations, the myth of the Hellslinger Phantom, and the recommissioned Black Thirteenth give this cadre real lineage. On the table, that history turns into tools: Caine’s witchmark into calamity sequencing, smart rack picks like Snipe or Deceleration, and Teleport that rescues overreach. Deuce backs the plan with true sight through clouds and stealth, arcane munitions that flex into blast or decrepitation, and focus economy near gun mages that keeps the damage rolling.
Bastian Falk holds the center with leadership that grants Reciprocate—miss us and you get punished—and a rune-forged scattergun that sets models ablaze or breaks armor where it counts. The Black Thirteenth—Ryan, Watts, and Glover—bring brutal damage, Pathfinder, Reposition, and chain attack control that forces your opponent to respect every lane. We share what clicks, what needs finesse, and where lore and balance meet in a cadre that feels fast, surgical, and dangerously fun.
If you love sharp lore, tighter lists, and hobby energy that spills into organized play, this one’s for you. Subscribe, share with your local meta, and drop a review with your two must-pick rack spells for Caine. What combos are you riding into your next game?
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Hey there, listeners, and JT here, bringing you fresh perspectives on all things war machine and building the community we surround ourselves with. Remember, we're not just tactics. Hey Angus. Hey Tony, what's going on? Oh, not a whole lot. Just getting things done and building the hobby up. Chris, how are you doing? Fantastic. Well, there you go. Any new hobbying between the two of you?
SPEAKER_03:Working on some Gador stuff and eagerly awaiting Crucible Guard STLs.
SPEAKER_02:There you go. I've just been painting up some of my old troll bloods and uh recently got your chimera that I'm going to start this week, probably.
SPEAKER_01:That's awesome. Excited to see those. Gonna be going in like a primary purple theme, I think. But today we've got the Hellslinger Starter Cadre that we're gonna be going over. So we're gonna dive into the lore of that and Alistair Kane. And I'm gonna shorten. And when I say shorten, I mean really shorten Alistair Kane's lore background. When you start looking into how much there is, I could spend probably more than a couple episodes just diving in on him, his background. He has an extensive lore profile. And if that's something you want us to do, I'm more than happy to do that. It might take a little bit of time to actually flesh everything out and kind of build up from Mark I to Mark II, three, four. But if that is something you want us to do, go ahead, leave a comment, let us know, and then that way we'll start looking into it. More than happy to accommodate those requests when our listeners kind of put in and let us know about things that they're interested in. Like we did the Brainblood's deep dive, and then we also did the Crick's lore. We also did a poll and we did the Dusk lore based on that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, you got four marks worth of history on that guy, so there's plenty there.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. He's got quite the background. And he's, like I said in the previous episode, he's definitely one of my more favorite casters. I think he's got just his background, his lore, the way he functions, the way he plays. I think he's just just a fun, fun caster. So what's your favorite part about Alistair Kane? Oh without diving too too far into it, I think how much of I will say, I don't want to say a mess-up he is, but how he's just so rough and abrasive and not what you would typically find in your like standard military service guy for this lore and world. That's fair.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Most of the guys are like very strict, especially when you compare him to certain Signarians and certain Ghidorians. You see them, they're very, very strict on how they function, and Alistair's kind of like, uh, we'll kind of fly by the seat of our pants and just go from there. He's definitely uh a rule breaker. Hence he keeps getting demoted and all sorts of other fun stuff. But Mark Four, he's a major, so he's obviously gotten more than a couple promotions, so there's that.
SPEAKER_02:Sounds like every Mark he works his way through the ranks. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Well, he does definitely do a whole lot of dirty work. I'm gonna go steal an aircraft carrier and get promoted for it. Somebody's got to. Afterwards.
SPEAKER_01:It was afterwards. And he basically signed a life indenture. It's true. Yeah. Once you once you sign you sign your life away, it's kind of like, uh but it was all for a good cause. Which we'll definitely cover that in the war company. Well, you should. I'm not saying you should. Especially yeah. He's a interesting guy. Anything else before we dive in? No. I'm ready to dive. Alright. So we're gonna go into the Signorian Hellslingers. The Hellslingers are a covert strike force of gun mage assassins working for Bolden Rabald. Bolden is a scout general of the Signorian Reconnaissance Service. Going forward, the Signorian Reconnaissance Service is going to be called the CRS. The Hellslingers are led by Alistair Cain. They are a direct successor to the Black Thirteenth, which was a militant order of the Arcane Tempest's Black Teams. The primary purpose of the Black Thirteenth was to hunt down and eliminate enemies of Signar. After some time on the run as enemies of the state, they were forced to work for Bolden Rabald as repayment for stealing a skyship to rescue Kane's daughter, Cynthia Roscoe, from Crix. See, there it is. Yep. I was gonna say it's right out in the open. The Hellslingers are a tight-knit group made up of Major Alistair Kane, his warjack Deuce, Kane's second, Captain Bastian Falk, and the surviving members of the Black 13th, Lieutenant Darcy Ryan, Sergeant Samuel Watts, and Corporal Freddie Glover. All are deadly fighters and highly skilled at what they do.
SPEAKER_02:Suzka's are a clandestine unit, right? Absolutely. That everyone knows about. And they have a giant jack that runs around with them. So it's not very sneaky. No.
SPEAKER_03:Everyone knows about them.
SPEAKER_01:So this is so everybody knows that they exist, especially as of current lore. As of current, they are definitely widely known. Going back in lore, Alistair functioned on his own. He was a single person that did his own thing. He wasn't part of a unit. With the second Orgoth invasion, we're jumping uh into some of the stuff coming up, but with the second Orgoth invasion, they were brought to the forefront. You guys need we need your skills out here. So they would show up and then they would disappear again. They'd be seen on the battlefield and then they would disappear. So kind of like the easiest way be like seeing the Navy SEALs. We know they're there, but you don't know what they're gonna do, you don't know when they're gonna show up. They just show up, get the job done, and then leave.
SPEAKER_02:Respectable.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. That's the easiest way that I can kind of put it that way, but they're also not just assassins, they're also intelligence, they do all sorts of nifty stuff. Their skills branch far. The Hellslingers are accustomed to working outside the laws and chain of command, with little assistance from the CRS. Origoth's arrival has brought the Hellslingers out of the shadows and onto the battlefield, being deployed alongside the Storm Legion and the trenchers, especially the gravediggers. They are capable of brutal arcane firepower despite their size. The Hellslingers are proven to be an unpredictable and powerful force in the battle. Cain, Rabald, and Dixon Lynch are all entangled in the history of the Hellslingers. Rabald had recruited both Kane and Lynch at different times in the CRS. Both Kane and Lynch were gun mages of the militant order of the Arcane Tempest. They would serve as operatives inside of the CRS. Now that kind of spans, we'll say almost 20 some years, 30 years.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that's all like Mark I through Mark III stuff.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, pretty much leading up to like Mark IV.
SPEAKER_02:Does this Rembrandt guy is he old?
SPEAKER_03:Or older? Oh yeah. He's gotta be at this point.
SPEAKER_01:No, he's actually kind of young. He's gotta be probably around uh without actually looking into that, he's probably around Alistair's age, maybe a little bit younger. Because he was the youngest general to be appointed to that position. But what is the youngest general? That I'm not sure. Fair point. That actually might be worth looking at. Now with a broad overview, we'll go into some gun mage history. Gun mages are casters who channel destructive magic into ammunition which is then fired through various firearms. Gun mages have existed in small numbers for centuries and even been recruited into the Royal High Guard of Signar. When witches and other Arcanists faced persecution, the young Arcane Tempest came together to hone their craft, while before most trained and studied in isolation with no specialized instructor. In five hundred eighty AR, a group of influential gun mages met with Warmaster General Karsten Lattermore to discuss the potential use of Martial Arcanists in the Signarian military. Do they have those gun mages in Mark IV?
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Or are they just called something else now?
SPEAKER_01:No, they're they have them in uh Yeah, they're part of the trencher army.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And they've all got berets now instead of uh Tricorn hats, which that's respectable. I don't know.
SPEAKER_01:I kind of like the Tricorn hats. I think that they agree. I like it, but I do like the fact that the the Black 13s still have them. And that kind of definitely sets them apart, besides the trench coats. Yeah. Trying to keep track of what the current year is for Mark IV, where we are currently as in like present day. I think it's 623 AR. Something like that. Yeah. Which means that the gun mages have only been involved in the military till relatively recently. Lattermore saw the immediate benefits and ordered a dedicated school to train the mages. The mages created detailed training, which was approved and they began instructing in five hundred eighty one. Between five hundred eighty one and five hundred eighty five, gun mages evolved dramatically. Four military branches with different needs were supplied with gun mages with skills that would meet their demands. With traditional firearms failing under the strain of the enchanted ammunition, the first mage lock firearms were created. Rune etched and alchemically hardened steel were created by teams of rulick metallurgists and signarian armory gunsmiths.
SPEAKER_02:So here's the real question: who approves gunmage school?
SPEAKER_01:Uh, that was the Warmaster. The Warmaster General. He's the one who, when the gun mages went to him and said, Hey, we want to be brought to the forefront. We want to bring the fight to the enemy. And the Warmaster General was like, Oh.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:You know what? Let's put you to the test. I like what you just did. Yeah, we're gonna get this done. So how do you guys train? How do you guys do this? They're like, well, we kind of do it by ourselves. We should stuff. Alright, we're gonna get this to be a school. This is gonna become a thing. We're gonna train you properly, like soldiers, and we're gonna make you a unit. And boom, they did. And it's been great. Among the Arcane Tempest's first officers was Dixon Lynch. Lynch was among the first recruits to join the new order. He became an instructor and helped establish its basic arcane traditions. He experimented with new arcane munitions and pioneered a number of rote spells that became the standards for gun mages. Lynch was the first commander of the Black Thirteenth, which established in the year five hundred ninety seven. Lynch served with honor and distinction until the year six hundred twelve, where he was slain by the Hellslinger Phantom. Little bit of a side note, the Hellslinger Phantom is rumored to have been created by a sliver of Alistair Kane's soul. Who would do such a devious thing? Denagra. I was gonna say the Crix. Sounds right up the rally. Yeah. Utilizing souls to manufacture clones sounds kind of crix-y to me. The best Alistair. I don't know if it's the best Alistair. Even though we did do some pretty good work with the Crix, I would definitely still say Alistair Kane. But it did take a lot more than Alistair Kane to bring down the Phantom. Which I'm sure there's probably a story out there that I haven't read on that yet. Might have to try to hunt that down here in the near future.
SPEAKER_03:I have no doubt it exists. Yeah, in like the lore section in the app, there's I don't know, three or four Kane stories.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, there's a number of them, because it's the Wrath of Kane. I'm sure one of them has to deal with the Phantom. Oh, I'm I'm pretty sure. But those I haven't read quite yet, and it is on my to-do list. And speaking of Kane, Major Alistair Kane, Gunmage, Spy, Assassin, Duelist, Soldier, Drunken Lout, and Father. Alistair Kane is many things to many people.
SPEAKER_02:Didn't they make a movie about that?
SPEAKER_01:Gary Oldman?
SPEAKER_02:Tinker Taylor Soldier Spy.
SPEAKER_01:I have no idea what you're talking about. That's a real movie. I I'm sure. I'm like, I've never heard of this. It was like up for Oscars and stuff. Doesn't mean I've seen it. That's fair. Usually if I see it's like, oh, Rotten Tomatoes, Hundred, I don't watch those. Usually that's not the kind of stuff I want to watch.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I usually don't take the critics' opinions very highly. Yeah. I don't.
SPEAKER_03:All you need to know is whether or not Bruce Campbell is in it. This is where I set myself apart and I say I disagree.
SPEAKER_01:You disagree, but you're wrong. Yeah. I was gonna say burn notice, I can handle them in. Otherwise, not the biggest fan. Burn notice. Yeah. Let's call it back in the archives. Sam X. Also, anything to do with Bruce Campbell is back in the archives. Lies. That's where he should have stayed, was back in the archives, but he still keeps walking to the forefront. Because he's amazing.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. He's the second greatest actor to ever live.
SPEAKER_01:Behind William Shatner? Yes. Okay. And this is how Angus ranks. I knew that. I was gonna say, I'm like, we all knew that. Notice how I jumped onto that one? I was like, yeah. William Shatner? Yep. Okay.
SPEAKER_02:Have you ever seen Boston Legal? Yes. Is it good? It's alright. Well, it's him and Spader, so I mean, that there should be like decent.
SPEAKER_01:I love James Spader. I will probably see about watching it. I knew he was in that. It had Shatner in it, and I was like, oh why? But it had multiple seasons. It did?
SPEAKER_02:So that's what I haven't seen it, but I it came across my reels or whatever. I think it does, doesn't it?
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I I don't know. I'll have to double check. I haven't like I said, I haven't watched it, but I know he's in there. Don't cut this. Oh, i I I probably won't. Perfect. This part of where you said don't cut the well, maybe I'll leave it in. I don't know. We'll see. Among the deadliest warcasters to ever live, he has spent the majority of it serving Rabald and the CRS. Rabald has used him as a trigger man on many clandestine missions, but when Kane's conscience has put him at odds with the Spymaster's plans, he ends up in Rabald's crosshairs. In six hundred twelve, when Alistair and crew commandeered an experimental skyship to save his daughter, Rabald and Kane patched over their differences. He accepted Rabald's terms and received his promotion to major, and has served the CRS since. Caine has covered his covert actions by adopting the persona of a drunken lout and an incapable officer, all the while facing constant disciplinary actions and demotions for his frequent absences, feigned insubordination, and brawling.
SPEAKER_02:Runs around doing whatever he wants and is like, yeah, yeah, he's in trouble, but yeah, they're not really in trouble.
SPEAKER_01:Legitimately, this is kind of like what we were talking about before, is he gives off this almost fake persona of being this incapable, rough, gruff, drunken idiot. And he's like, Oh, I'm hungover. I'm gonna be I'm gonna sleep this off for the next day or two, and he's actually out on mission. Probably drunk. On mission. Yes.
SPEAKER_03:I I definitely uh That's my only bone to pick with this, is he's probably actually like drunk the entire time. That's why it's such a good shot. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Well, that it's the arcane munitions that he probably craps. Naturally. Spells of bullet straightening. He takes the aim action every time he goes. A cast true flight. Now we're gonna move on to Deuce. Clandestine warjack. It's very stealthy. That's that's the thing that I'd never understood about the concept of stealthy jacks. They're so big and so heavy. Well at least Ace was a tiny jack. But it's still like it's still I don't know. I can't wait for Mark V when we get thrice. Right? The Hellslingers once again returned to the patronage of the CRS. This arrangement led to the creation of a one of a kind gun mage support warjack that came at great expense to the realm. Deuces based on the striker chassis. The accumulator, which traditionally functioned off of the galvanic power generated by the Storm Legion forces, was replaced with a specialized system that drew power from the gun mages spellcasting. The standard optical systems were replaced with advanced magical systems to see through obfuscations. Deuce is armed with a proprietary spell storm cannon. It is capable of firing an array of arcane munitions, and it was pioneered for cane based off his first jack ace, the Black thirteenth. The last of the joint CRS are Kane Tempest Black Teams that were established to hunt down Inquisitors and Signorin traitors following the Lions coup. Originally, they were led by Captain Dixon Lynch, who was killed by the Hellslinger Phantom while pursuing the renegade warcaster Alistair Cain. That is one of those things that when you read through it and you find out that they were hunting down Alistair Kane. They were hunting him down to kill him. And then you turn around and work for the guy that's out actively out to try to kill you for over ten years. It's for me, it's a little out there. Maybe it's just me.
SPEAKER_02:That's a little goofy. Should have said with the Crixian Alistair. Well, so technically they did kill Alistair, just not the right one. Yeah. I mean Or I guess you could say the wrong one, but depending on how you look at it.
SPEAKER_03:I wouldn't mind having a Crixian Alistair in my Crix army. Please no.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Alistair's already bad enough, and if it takes the real Alistair and the Black Thirteenth to kill it, yeah. Following Lynch's death, the surviving members, Darcy Ryan and Samuel Watts, joined Kane to slay the Phantom. The Black Thirteenth was only recommissioned after Kane's return to Scout General Bolden Rabault's service in six hundred twelve AR. Ryan is the youngest of the team and a sharp witted officer. Watts is a troubled man with an inclination towards violence. His loyalties are only to Ryan and Cain in that order. The newest member, Freddy Glover, is a veteran gun mage who served behind enemy lines in support of the resistance. His double barreled mage lock was a gift from the resistance fighters he fought alongside. Was that uh Lalele against Kator? Yes. Now, the funny thing that when you see this, Watts, right? What weapon does Watts have? Uh, is he the one with the like blunderbuss? No, that's Bastion Falcon. We're we're about to cover him. He's the guy with a sniper rifle. Okay. And when you have a guy who has an inclination towards violence with a sniper rifle, it just s again, doesn't sit really well. But all these guys have brutal damage as a rule? Alright. It just it just seemed a little weird. Like normally those guys are you're gonna see they're like more up close, they're a little more melee oriented. Right. This one, not so much. And also when you see him, he's got when we go into the rules section, I didn't find his rules to fit him very well. But we'll we'll cover that here in a little bit. Don't get me wrong, the Black Thirteenth are an amazing squad. It's just some of the lore just in my opinion doesn't stack with them, but some of the models they just don't. Now Bastian Falk. Bastian joined the Hellslingers on the mission to help save Kane's daughter from Crix. He did this because he's a friend of Kane's.
SPEAKER_00:What a guy.
SPEAKER_01:He is a veteran of decades of wars. From Cador to Crix and Pirate Hordes. He is a gun mage of singular power, he prefers his scatter gun to the typical armaments, each shell is rune empowered, and the shot itself is cast from the same metallurgical alloy that the mage lock balls are produced from. Makes sense. Right? But mind you, each one of those is small. And the process to make those balls is intense. Now you're talking about making tons of tiny ones. That's why they go to school. I mean also, yes.
SPEAKER_03:We need more interns.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Pay really well too. Bust out the magnifying glass and start scribing runes. The little chisel and pick. Yep.
SPEAKER_01:I'm I'm little babies. Yeah. Well, it'd be on the shell. The babies would be the treated metal. The shell would be what empowers it. That's true. Or the casing. Falk first served under Kane in defense against the Codor in six hundred four. He owes Cain an unshakable debt for saving his husband's life on the battlefield. He would cover for Cain's frequent absences. That's a bro right there. He knew little of Cain's missions, but knew Kane was committed to the important work of the CRS. Falk was left to command Cain's troops in his absence, resulting Cain's trust in Falk like few others had. Now we're gonna kinda jump it to present day. The Hellslingers straddled the line between elite soldiers and intelligence operatives. Their ties to the CRS, Signorian military, and the criminal underbelly allows them to have much further reach in the Iron Kingdoms than most would, especially at their size. With Orgos' arrival, they have taken to the battlefield with the Storm Legion, gravediggers, and Signorian allies abroad, including throughout Southern Kador. These operations are conducted with complete secrecy, and they depart as quickly as they arrive for their next assignment. Even though, still tasked with Bolden's dirty work, fighting openly on the front lines has restored a sense of honor and duty that had been lost while operating from the shadows for the past decades. Their deeds may not only help secure the Iron Kingdoms from tyranny at the hands of the demon worshipping barbarians, but may also redeem their souls. Now we're gonna dive into the rules. And the last couple episodes we've I want to say tiptoed around the rules a little bit. We've touched on how the lore impacts it. These are set. So we'll kind of dive in a little bit more on these guys and talk about how the rules are influenced by the lore, how it applies, and also just general things that we like about it. Alright, so we'll go ahead and we'll start with Alistair Kane.
SPEAKER_03:Well, he certainly likes his pistols. He's got the gunfighter ability. So he can start shooting people in combat. Or in close combat. Well that and he has no melee weapons either.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. You know, rat of nine, he's really good. It's gross. And then his pistols are range twelve, put snipe on there, now he's range fifteen. And each of his pistols, because he carries two, has reload one. So you stack up a little bit of focus, you'd be putting off four shots, and with Heartseeker, again, throwing two high dice, not a bad little way to go.
SPEAKER_03:Fortunately, his arc is pretty low.
SPEAKER_01:So Well, but the other thing is shooting can't get too out of hand. Well, but he's also got witchmark. If this attack hits an enemy model during its model's activation until the end of the activation, this model can target and automatically hit the enemy model with spells, ignoring range and line of sight. Sure, but you still gotta pay for the attacks. Correct. But all you need is one shot with witchmark to go off, and that's a free shot, and now all of a sudden you're hitting them with whatever you want. So gross. Now, a little bit going into his abilities, the fact that he has headshot leads into the assassin and duelist in his background. Also, because he does lead and he has led multiple units, his leadership gun mage, while within 10 inches of this model friendly gun mage models gain headshot, really kind of falls in line with his lethality.
SPEAKER_03:Agreed. Now, I don't play with these guys, but I know you do. I assume you usually put Calamity on him as one of the uh spells.
SPEAKER_01:So Calamity is an auto spell, same thing with heightened reflexes and teleport, and he gets the rack of two spells, and that's where I I've kind of I've dove a little bit into Sentry and Snipe the last couple times I've played him. Because I want to really begin to feel them out and kind of put some work in with him. Using Snipe has worked out pretty well.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah, that was unpleasant for me.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, minus two defense and armor, and especially when all I gotta do is shoot you. Well, a chicken did just that. You know, cast snipe on yourself, your range goes up to 15 inches, I'm gonna I'm gonna hit ya, and I'll hit ya with witch mark, and now I'm gonna cast Calamity, and then then it's not great. Who gives this guy snipe? You can. You choose snipe in your rack. I was gonna say, since you don't really play a whole lot of Mark IV armies, so when you look at his list, you see that. There's Calamity, Heightened Reflexes, and Teleport. Right. And above it, it says rack slots two. When you create your list, you can go in and you can select two other spells from your spell list and put them in there. So you can have a total of five. Interesting. And your rack spells are what's really going to diversify when you realize, oh, I'm going against Brine Bloods. I want to sh I want to shoot them down. You're going to pick things like that. And that way you'll be able to help kind of eliminate the threat as they're advancing. That makes sense.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, my legacy armies don't have that kind of privilege.
SPEAKER_01:It's unfortunate. But you get like six or seven spells, though.
unknown:True.
SPEAKER_01:They're just picked for you, and usually they're really good.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, I like Thagrash's spells.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I'm sure you do. Ugh, Dragonblood. That's a great spell.
SPEAKER_01:Deceleration, Dragonblood. I just I wanna I wanna tap out. Alright. Anything else on Alistair Kane? Uh not at the top of my head.
SPEAKER_03:Just perusing the spell options. I feel like snipe is a must.
SPEAKER_01:Especially with the Black 13th. And then having Watts be able to shoot 17 inches, that's really nice.
SPEAKER_02:Where does it show their spell list?
SPEAKER_03:Uh you go into the build of force. Yeah, and you have to create a list. Are these spell cards?
SPEAKER_02:Yep. Oh, they have the acceleration.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:It's a handy one.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, they have a number of different ones. And I'm I'm looking at this through the Gravedigger side, not necessarily the Storm Legion side, but they can be utilized on both. Right. And if you also go to the Storm Legion side, you'll see different spells. Really? Yep. So if you play Alistair Cain as the Storm Legion side, you'll have access to. Yep. You'll have a bunch of different other options.
SPEAKER_00:That's good.
SPEAKER_02:So for him you can pick two of these. Yep. Interesting. At some point in my life I'll have to get a mark for Army. Well, again.
SPEAKER_01:I was gonna say Kithgard is coming. It's at this point, probably around three months away.
SPEAKER_02:That's soon enough.
SPEAKER_01:I was gonna say, I'm like, not that I'm counting down or anything, but come on, February. Could always play Cador? I could. Or Chimera, or Brine Bloods, or Dusk. Lots of good options. Old Umbre. There's a number. Or Goth. Alright, so now let's look at Deuce. And again, Deuce has the accumulator gun mage. When he begins his activation, within three inches of a friendly gun mage model, this model gains one focus. Solid. Do the black thirteenth count as a gun mage?
SPEAKER_02:All of them count as a gun mage. Okay, so that's how that synergy plays out.
SPEAKER_01:Yep. All every single one of those guys in the Hellslinger cadre is a gun mage. And then again, having the special optics, he has true sight, which allows him to ignore cloud effects when determining line of sight. Also ignores stealth. Rude. It's good for those crooks. It is not. I agree and disagree at the exact same time.
SPEAKER_02:I would think his spellstorm mechanic would be more power. I mean Oh, it's plenty powerful.
SPEAKER_03:Well, and then something to sneeze at, but I was figure. The trick to it is he gets extra dice against Jackson, undead.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So he has decrepitation, which is really good within its own right. And then so that gives him an extra damage die. Then he goes and he can spend one focus for power attack, which boosts attack and damage rolls. So if you're shooting as a jack or against undead models, you can have four dice against whatever you're shooting at. And with power 14, I mean Sounds good for critics too. I mean, that could be what? If you roll four sixes, you're looking at 38. You know, weirder things have happened. And he can reload once. Yep. And since he can have three, he gets his shot, you power attack it, reload, power attack again. That's your three focus, he's putting two shots down range, and if you're shooting at a jack or an undead, you're looking at quite a bit of damage. That's just a regular old blade. That also gives you plus one armor. So then he goes up to armor 19. But there is ways around it. Of course. Which the blade is also magical. And it also has the throw power attack. Not bad for a sword.
SPEAKER_03:Nope. It's been a while since I've actually seen the model, but isn't it just like brass knuckles? Uh no.
SPEAKER_01:It it's it's actually got like a like a little hook to a point and then s curves back down. Okay. Like a Rambo knife?
SPEAKER_02:With the built-in brass knuckles?
SPEAKER_01:No. This is it's almost like a like a gauntlet that goes over his hand, and then it's like a curved, spiked blade. And with the multiple different types of arcane munitions, he has beatback, blast, and decrepitation. And the blast turns his power 14 gun into an AoE 2, power 12, 6. Which It's acceptable in the right circumstance. They definitely did some decent work against the Crick's Bane Warriors when they were coming through. Could see that. I think I killed three with one shot. But then the next ones I didn't do much of anything on the next second shot. I rolled terribly. Alright, so we'll go to Bastion Falk next. It's really on the Crick side anyway. I mean Falk when when you're working both sides of the table, I mean, it's fine. It's true. Bastion Falk, following in the lore, because he was commanding Alistair Kane's armies while he was gone, or I should say forces, he has leadership gun mages, and they all have reciprocate. Which reciprocate is when the model is missed by an enemy ranged attack. Immediately after the attack is resolved, this model can make one basic ranged attack targeting the attacking model. That's impressive. The problem is that his range is kind of short. Yeah. It's not bad though. No, it's not, especially as a free ability and to get a free attack. And especially with his attack, he has the arcane munitions through his scatter gun. He can banish, he also has decrepitation, which is fantastic, and he also has incidiary. All he's gonna do is hit, and then they're set on fire. Yeah. Fire is no fun. Yeah. Spray's not the snooze at either. I personally would have liked to have seen spray ten, because he is using arcade blunderbuss, and I think thematically it would have fit a little bit better, but I think this is still probably a little too good.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think like Winter Guard rifles are range ten.
SPEAKER_01:But Winter Guard rifles, not arcane.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Special arcane.
SPEAKER_02:Doesn't Mr. Bugs have a blunderbuster?
SPEAKER_01:Winter guard has and I want to say it's range the deck sweeper. I want to say he's range ten. It's too bad. So he is range ten. And that's what I'm saying. He has a deck sweeper. So there's no reason that his couldn't have been. Right. But I think for the versatility of what it is, still not bad. And I do think a lot of his rules do line up. Same thing with Alistair and with Deuce. Now for the Black 13th. Well, we can't forget about his sword. Oh, yes, we can. Yeah, absolutely we can. Kind of like the Black 13th and all their gun blades, rifle butt, trench knife. Yeah, we can skip all that. Because none of that matters. Yeah, and Watts, rifle butt, pow six. Ugh. Looking at their rules, Ryan has prey. And this is again, there might be more lore to this that we haven't been able to get to, and that would further explain why Watts has some some of these rules and Ryan has other ones. But I could see it being flip-flop between Watts and Ryan getting Watts getting prey. Because again, that tendency towards violence, marking your targets with a sniper rifle. But I can also see prey being on her because she's the leader. She knows who they're going after. She's marking the targets.
SPEAKER_02:Makes sense.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I I see it, I can see it being both ways. I I don't see Glover ever having it, but Glover also having the spyglass grants true sight. Which again, that makes sense to me why he would have that. And also being behind enemy lines, you're gonna want to have line of sight, you're gonna want to be able to make sure you can see everything. So Glover makes sense. Ryan with Prey makes sense. Every single one of these guys has brutal damage. Watts and Glover have Black Penny, Watts has Blast, Glover has Momentum, and probably the most interesting for me was the chain attack Mage Storm. If this model hits the same model with both of its initial attacks, you can choose to center a cloud effect template on the model hit. The template is a hazard that remains in play for one round. A model entering or ending its activation in the template suffers a POW 12 fire damage roll. Terrible. You're forcing an area to avoid. Yeah. And all you gotta do is hit twice. I mean, rat 7 shouldn't be that hard. Right.
SPEAKER_03:Shouldn't be.
SPEAKER_01:But and that's where I lean into, shouldn't be, but I've really struggled to get both shots on. I can get one. I just for whatever reason I've been very unfortunate at getting the second ones. You should definitely avoid Cador then.
SPEAKER_03:That's that's one that I'm doing is going to drive you nuts, because we just don't do it.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and I will definitely say At least the range. Rough C's against Cador was the most wonderful thing I've done. Chris, for rough seas, do you know what that spell does? I remember it, I just don't remember it. So no. Rough C's, what it does is when in a unit or a model in your spellcaster's control is targeted by a ranged attack, they have to roll an additional dice and drop the highest. Uh when you have already bad shooting. Yes. I've done that to ranged trolls, I've done that to Cutor. When I'm playing as uh as Commodore Foulblood, that's like one of my go-tos. If I know there's gonna be shooting, I always take rough C's, because it's gonna end up saving me a lot. Right. I like that in Black Spot. Black Spot's good too.
SPEAKER_02:So is this is Ryan and Watts were they in previous editions? Yes, they were.
SPEAKER_03:They've been on threes and lovers of one. Yeah, Mark's one through three, it was Lynch, uh Ryan and Watts. Correct. Uh I see.
SPEAKER_01:And then they shifted over after into Mark IV, where Lynch dies. So they and that's where you get Glover.
SPEAKER_02:Gotcha. The best thing is the guy at the rifle button, a power six. Yeah. Matt Six.
SPEAKER_01:And this is the guy who has the affinity for, you know, violence. Of course, it's not the worst power weapon. I guess I I looked at it and I was like, why? Why?
SPEAKER_02:At the very least, they should have the trench knife.
SPEAKER_01:That's okay. I would have thought the trench knife, but I under uh I don't know. Like I said, that's the reason why when I look at the Black 13th, they are such a good unit, but lore-wise, I think there could have been a little bit more of a tie-in.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But again, there might be more side stories and other little bits that I haven't gotten to yet that could explain all of this. And I'd be like, oh, I was completely wrong, and this is why this all makes sense. Just from reading the Hellslinger compendium, that's where I've gotten to. It's pretty much where I'm at.
SPEAKER_02:It could just be balance too.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it very well could be, to be fair, from what I understand, the Black 13th is arguably one of the best units in the game right now.
SPEAKER_02:Well, yeah, I've played it against them.
SPEAKER_01:I've agree with that. I will definitely say I do not dislike them. Especially they've got Pathfinder, so you can just move them around, reposition three, pray. Oh, you can pretty much do whatever you need them to do. Prowl.
SPEAKER_02:Other than beat somebody in melee.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. But the other thing is, is if you get to melee, you've obviously messed up. Yeah. It was like you've already messed up.
SPEAKER_02:You repositioned them wrong.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. You're not supposed to reposition them towards the enemy. Unless you're not with the blessing. Oh, yes. Yes. That's true. That's why I'm waiting on decrepitation and incidiary and hope for the best. Yeah. Because that's all gonna end terribly for me. I just want to AoE them to death. Yeah, AoE six on armor, you know. 20. Yeah. It's fine.
SPEAKER_02:Oh wow. All my guns are power 14 anywho, so are they boostable? Two of them are. Okay.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Well, Dozer and Smig.
SPEAKER_01:Dunjarn. I was gonna say, you just uh you just made that comment that Dozer's ready and hungry for a rematch. Yeah. Chum is always hungry for a rematch. Chum's always ready. The stinky boy is always ready to go. I think that we've pretty much covered everyone. Would agree. What would be your overall takes on the Hellslingers as a whole? Um I know it's not where your heart's at.
SPEAKER_03:No. I think they're nice models. I don't really have much interest in playing with them, but I do have them, and I plan to paint them up at some point. I would agree.
SPEAKER_01:I absolutely love the Black 13th, and especially because they still have the Tricorn hats. Yeah. Uh I I I enjoy they have the flowing capes and the whole and I love Alistair's duster in this one. As one of my DD characters was this cowboy gunslinger kind of thing, and then I see Alistair in this edition. I must have this guy. Heck yeah. It was just it was too it was perfect.
SPEAKER_03:Oh maybe I can lop Alistair's head off on mine and put like a skull there and throw him into my Crick's army.
SPEAKER_01:There you go. Hey. You know what?
SPEAKER_02:I will support this. Just call it uh what are they done made a pistol wraith? Pistol wraith, that's the word. Yeah. Yeah. Sadly those are gone. Yeah. Oh, they're legacy.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, you could go into legacy. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And uh yeah, their necrofactorum doesn't have uh the Hellslinger Phantom either. Uh huh. It's a tragedy. Which, by the way, I was discussing with Angus about the uh Hellslinger Phantom earlier, and we looked at the model, and we think that that model is is pretty good. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:It's definitely gotta be one of those Mark III models.
SPEAKER_01:I was gonna say it's a model for it? Yep. Yeah. Awesome. Because uh him and I were talking about it, and he's like, Yeah, they don't make a model. I was like, No, I I thought I I I saw one earlier, and so I went through and I s and we both looked it up, and it was obviously a Mark III model, because when you look at the the background image, you can see it's like Primatier Press, it's got a certain the number, and it's got the telltale background of Mark III. Well, just the sculpt looks great. Yeah, and it and it is. Some of the older Crix ones, I'm like, eh. But this one is definitely a good one. The only thing I do think it looks a little funny about the Hellslinger Phantom is it's the bottom, like his like where his feet would be. The base? No, it he's like kicked out, like his robe is kicked forward, and it's just like a just like a blotch.
SPEAKER_03:Ghosty floating.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And it that's probably the only thing, but as soon as you go right past that and you look at the upper two-thirds of the model, it's fantastic. Model them inside a bush or something. I was gonna say, I'm like, you can fix that with a conveniently placed rock. Like you just put some rock. Yep, exactly. Just drop a little something in front of it. Now you never notice. It's good to go.
SPEAKER_02:There you go.
SPEAKER_01:Happy in 101. Exactly. Yeah, we've definitely conveniently fixed some of that. Oh, this one doesn't fit right. Well, it looks like a rock will fit underneath that foot. Now he's gonna be balanced. Perfect. Or a head. Yep.
SPEAKER_02:And I'll just slide one of those under there.
SPEAKER_01:Yep. Skulls. Skulls, yeah. That was one thing I noticed about aberration. One of his feet seemed like it was too high. Did I build this wrong? And then I looked at a few other people's and it was the same way. I was like, okay, it's not just me. All right. So I just took some green stuff and I mounded up and kind of made like slant uh slopes. I didn't know. If people look at the photos from the battle that we did on the previous Sunday, you'll see my aberration and you'll see a bunch of the green stuff from where I I mound it up and support his foot underneath, and it will make it look like he's walking on like some sort of a hill.
SPEAKER_00:I don't know.
SPEAKER_01:Or some sort of a mound of something.
SPEAKER_02:Bodies. Yeah. You can go on eBay and find a sorcer for cheap.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, that's true. I could. Man. I could. Well, how many of those you got laying around? Oh, a ton.
SPEAKER_03:I have one too. Do you?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, she's right over here. I'm kind of ashamed of that.
SPEAKER_03:I swear, every time I like buy something for Kedora on eBay, like someone throws a sorcery.
SPEAKER_01:Oh yes. Thank you present. Yeah. Do you know how many? Do you know how many of these we have? I actually I got from a coworker. He basically uh seemed like he was done with War Machine and just the hobby tabletop wargaming in general. And we started talking, and then I let him know about how we were starting the podcast, and it was going to be a War Machine podcast. And he had given me all this stuff. Well, needless to say, he went and he bought Old Umbre, he bought Necrofactorum, so he dove right back in to the hobby. He's now in Mark 4. I'm hoping uh time of recording, he'll be coming out tomorrow to play up at the sanctum in Racine. Just when you think you're out, we broke your right neck. Exactly. I told him I was like, hey man, like when you think you're done, you're never done. You can never escape the hobby. No, it always drags you back. Whether you're kicking, screaming, running towards it, you know, whatever, you're always back in.
SPEAKER_02:It's true.
SPEAKER_01:You have this positive community and you have this wonderful group. And being able to sit here and say this with all sincerity and actuality, I get to sit here with two of my best friends, and I'm doing this podcast with them. I have made other friends along the way through this hobby, and have been able to develop and bring out communities to this, has been an absolute wild ride. And the best part is we're only getting started with this. I'm just warming up. It's true. I've got a lot more to go.
SPEAKER_02:Usually for games, it just takes one to you two to be like, hey, I'm playing this game. It's like, all right, I'll play. Right. Well, that's basically what it is for this. Like we're out, and then Angus and I, you still got your trolls? We're starting War Machine again. Do you want to play? Like, I still got the trolls, so yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and it was funny because I sat there and we saw that the Mark IV was coming, and I reached out to Angus and I was like, hey man, I still got all my war machine. Do you still have your stuff? And he's like, Yeah, you want to go get a game in? The rules are free on the app. Yeah. So we met up, we played a game. Dude, this is exactly what I wanted. And now we're at what? Yeah, Mark Four has been pretty good. When we get everybody in the gaming group, if we got everybody there at once, we're looking at eight or nine people.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And that's that's just for our one little group in Illinois that's not even up here, that's not reaching out to other people, other stores. That's just the one that we go to in Grays Lake.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, one of the Discords I'm in, there's a group that plays down south of us on Wednesdays.
SPEAKER_01:So I'll have to see on uh days that I have off. I I do want to travel to some of these other local gaming stores. They they might be a little farther away from me, but it is something I do want to get down to. I want to dive into some of these other communities, see what they're like. The fact that we have people actually listening to us and is it's kind of wild. I never thought that it would start branching out to what it is. And even then, comparatively, we're very, very small. We do have some very good listeners, and you know, we do have a lot of actually engagement, which has been wonderful, and that's all I can ask for. Yeah. Can't complain. Nope. Makes it all worthwhile. All right, guys. I think that's all I got. Yeah. Chris?
unknown:All right.
SPEAKER_02:Just excited to go start painting those uh chimera guys. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Next week I'm on vacation, which is going to give me a lot more time to hobby and get some backlog projects done.
SPEAKER_03:I sent a uh form out to Steamforge to try and get a hold of the organized play kit to take a look at.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. Yeah. I think that would be kind of nice to get a hold of and look at, especially because we're we're trying to start branching out there, especially coming into the new year. I've kind of set that as a personal goal into looking into organized play and uh start bringing that into our local shops and really trying to drum it up. And also potentially starting to travel a little bit more. Maybe even head out to, you know, some of the conventions and actually start meeting some of these people out here.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And we're lucky we're close by one of the big four. So Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Adepticon is not too far away, and hopefully be able to get in there a couple months. I'm gonna be looking into potentially press passes, see about getting those.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, the previews for those events should be coming out usually December.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I I took a look, press passes. I believe I saw that it they start in January.
SPEAKER_00:Huh.
SPEAKER_01:Which I I figured it would have been a month a lot earlier, but I'll double check again. But if anybody has inside connections, feel free. Send us a message, let us know. Uh also, I'm debating between Nova and possibly going out towards potentially Vegas for the next conventions. There you go. I think probably Nova. I think Nova is probably gonna be where I'm gonna go. Where's Nova? I think it's in Washington, D.C. Just That sounds right. Yeah, I was gonna say, I'm like, I think, but I'm hoping that I'll be able to get out there. Definitely Adepticon this year, and hopefully gonna try to swing out there for Nova. And again, people with connections to either one of those, let me know. All right. Have a good day, guys. Doodles. Have a good one.
unknown:Ow.
